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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:12:49 GMT
Uhhhh I don't see where I imply I know for sure scorrch is town??? Like, I have a heavy townread on scorrch by this point, and it's a well built / reasoned argument that I argued back with my own points - but uh, literally don't see where I say that nor imply that at all? >> Top three are active, contributing to the game trying to work through what we got - think quo / scorr / snaq is the pool we should look at rewarding next phase, more likely quojova bc he's the townie who's consistently working for third party conflict resolution, as you said Is this your argument? This is the only post I can see where you have stated a read on Mr ? and it comes after the post I mentioned. You were looking at Mr ?'s allegations as coming from a town player and were able to formulate an explanation. That means you know he is town or atleast heavily townread him , no? No, and please don't push words in my mouth - I never stated that as my argument, nor implied it. As I said in my previous post, by the post in question, I had him fairly securely as a heavy townread, and treated the argument as such. The townread was due to low activity, high presence - where I read his posts as reading thread, making reads and pushing their own opinions - the scumread on me was just another showing of that, and the only thing that would leave me to consider scum!scorr at that point in time would be for an alex + scorr team to exist - which seems unlikely considering the events that: alex's partner is brazenly trying and get the person pushing alex as the vote voted off when alex isn't the major wagon at that post. How do you see a difference between knowing he's town vs. strictly townreading a user, and what do you think it shows? Did you specifically frame that question as such because you scumleaned me already? |
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Post by quojova on Feb 7, 2021 23:16:05 GMT
Yeahh I was in a state of frustration and absolute anger at that point and honestly wasn't thinking straight In a more realistic scenario, I don't think flush would provide explicit fakeclaims, although I still still believe that claims such as that don't tell me a whole lot in a closed setup. I still don't believe alex is exactly town with their claim, although the rift thingie is definitely interesting and i'll expand on that later re: this thing This series of posts was strange. Like I don't think being so angry and frustrated about a game of mafia that your thinking gets all warped to the point of making such a logical leap is an actual human thing (although this is contestable for sure). The phrasing of it just seems very dismissive of it like there's some content AZ wants to move away from. Perhaps he's trying to move away from how he leapt too quickly to "Alex's claim doesn't help him at all" in a self-preservation oriented move because he knew he was the only viable cw? And he says he'll "expand on that later" but that feels like a token expression planted to make the post most agreeable in a way that is not honest given that he has like a minute to discuss whether or not Alex is a good kill before he flips. restating; this ended up sounding more theoretical than it is because I got too bogged town in the details, which I think are important but obfuscate the main point, which was that he was dismissing his previous leap of logic that pushed Alex down with "I was really angry", and I find that scummy. I actually do care about this what do the rest of you think about this line of logic and about AZ in general? |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:17:25 GMT
Both need mad pressuring / questioning but thread's got like 4 diff scum targets atm probably not dubz given that the primary argument for his scumminess is mechanical with litt maple might be good also derz Makes sense, and I'm fine with both, preferable to maple. Maple, I've just got like 0 idea what's going on in that head or w/ those posts and I basically wanna question everything they're doing |
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Post by quojova on Feb 7, 2021 23:19:46 GMT
probably not dubz given that the primary argument for his scumminess is mechanical with litt maple might be good also derz Makes sense, and I'm fine with both, preferable to maple. Maple, I've just got like 0 idea what's going on in that head or w/ those posts and I basically wanna question everything they're doing so who would we swap with them? does anyone want to swap? |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:20:12 GMT
probably not dubz given that the primary argument for his scumminess is mechanical with litt maple might be good also derz so if we agree upon a target to swap with as a complete town we can unionize and collectively bargain with the person we choose by threatening to hang them if they don't pick our agreed upon target if we make this relationship explicit we can get around the whole "the people we 'reward' have agency" problem very totalitarian but very effective Would require us to be able to convince the other side to hang the rewarded person as well, bc otherwise it's 3-4 phases (1 for them to swap to, vote someone, swap back, we vote them), and that's not an effective use of our votes |
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Post by quojova on Feb 7, 2021 23:23:14 GMT
so if we agree upon a target to swap with as a complete town we can unionize and collectively bargain with the person we choose by threatening to hang them if they don't pick our agreed upon target if we make this relationship explicit we can get around the whole "the people we 'reward' have agency" problem very totalitarian but very effective Would require us to be able to convince the other side to hang the rewarded person as well, bc otherwise it's 3-4 phases (1 for them to swap to, vote someone, swap back, we vote them), and that's not an effective use of our votes well if we all agree that townies should listen to the town consensus and not go rogue, and we agree that the punishment for going rogue is getting hanged and they do it anyway, that sounds like solid grounds for the other side to hang them |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:30:13 GMT
Would require us to be able to convince the other side to hang the rewarded person as well, bc otherwise it's 3-4 phases (1 for them to swap to, vote someone, swap back, we vote them), and that's not an effective use of our votes well if we all agree that townies should listen to the town consensus and not go rogue, and we agree that the punishment for going rogue is getting hanged and they do it anyway, that sounds like solid grounds for the other side to hang them See that, just worried that the other side is going to be too focused on their own arguments / suspicions to look at that first - might just be a problem for if / when we go through with the plan though |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:31:49 GMT
Makes sense, and I'm fine with both, preferable to maple. Maple, I've just got like 0 idea what's going on in that head or w/ those posts and I basically wanna question everything they're doing so who would we swap with them? does anyone want to swap? Preferably we just swap someone ~suspicious~ out so it doesn't become a scum!majority on one side controlling votes and town!majority on the other side trying to trickle in - Animal is currently the one popping into my head w/ that in mind |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:33:03 GMT
re: this thing This series of posts was strange. Like I don't think being so angry and frustrated about a game of mafia that your thinking gets all warped to the point of making such a logical leap is an actual human thing (although this is contestable for sure). The phrasing of it just seems very dismissive of it like there's some content AZ wants to move away from. Perhaps he's trying to move away from how he leapt too quickly to "Alex's claim doesn't help him at all" in a self-preservation oriented move because he knew he was the only viable cw? And he says he'll "expand on that later" but that feels like a token expression planted to make the post most agreeable in a way that is not honest given that he has like a minute to discuss whether or not Alex is a good kill before he flips. restating; this ended up sounding more theoretical than it is because I got too bogged town in the details, which I think are important but obfuscate the main point, which was that he was dismissing his previous leap of logic that pushed Alex down with "I was really angry", and I find that scummy. I actually do care about this what do the rest of you think about this line of logic and about AZ in general? I think less so the "making huge leaps of logics or brushing past your argument's weakpoints due to emotional blindness" is the issue with AZ, but moreso thecontext it was used in, where AZ was the major wagon at that point, and used that argument as their major reasoning for jumping on and plurshifting from themselves. Questions for you AlmostZero: How much of your scumread on Alex was motivated by not wanting to be voted off that same day? Currently, it looks slightly opportunistic. |
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Post by quojova on Feb 7, 2021 23:33:31 GMT
well if we all agree that townies should listen to the town consensus and not go rogue, and we agree that the punishment for going rogue is getting hanged and they do it anyway, that sounds like solid grounds for the other side to hang them See that, just worried that the other side is going to be too focused on their own arguments / suspicions to look at that first - might just be a problem for if / when we go through with the plan though I also just doubt anyone is going to paint such rebellion on their back, even if the consequences of that take 3-4 days to manifest so do you have any interest in swapping? |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:36:40 GMT
See that, just worried that the other side is going to be too focused on their own arguments / suspicions to look at that first - might just be a problem for if / when we go through with the plan though I also just doubt anyone is going to paint such rebellion on their back, even if the consequences of that take 3-4 days to manifest so do you have any interest in swapping? Doesn't really matter to me, will probably be doing similar things either way Also wanna point out it does look like Maple / Spiderz may have a mechanical confrontation between the two of them |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:37:27 GMT
I also just doubt anyone is going to paint such rebellion on their back, even if the consequences of that take 3-4 days to manifest so do you have any interest in swapping? Doesn't really matter to me, will probably be doing similar things either way Also wanna point out it does look like Maple / Spiderz may have a mechanical confrontation between the two of them Also, those 3-4 days could be the difference between winning and losing for them so it's an idea to consider that it could be a calculated play on that front |
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Post by quojova on Feb 7, 2021 23:40:35 GMT
I also just doubt anyone is going to paint such rebellion on their back, even if the consequences of that take 3-4 days to manifest so do you have any interest in swapping? Doesn't really matter to me, will probably be doing similar things either way Also wanna point out it does look like Maple / Spiderz may have a mechanical confrontation between the two of them If you're referring to the n1 roleblock things I think that's really minor and isn't of much impact in the other thread anymore |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 7, 2021 23:43:50 GMT
Doesn't really matter to me, will probably be doing similar things either way Also wanna point out it does look like Maple / Spiderz may have a mechanical confrontation between the two of them If you're referring to the n1 roleblock things I think that's really minor and isn't of much impact in the other thread anymore Ah, I saw snaq point it out just now and was like "ah, this may just conf one of them" |
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Post by quojova on Feb 7, 2021 23:46:15 GMT
I don't like how dubz has mostly disregarded litt's pseudo-investigative claim. I obviously don't expect him to agree with the results but he hasn't shown any interest in figuring out what actually happened there.
Litt also needs to come back and explain
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Post by quojova on Feb 7, 2021 23:50:01 GMT
I think he was just thanking maple for dropping gimmick
Possible source of a semi-mechanical tl for maple is that I would expect a scum with partners to realize that the setup is role madness and not go make this leap that derz must have targeted them with a kill because there wasn't any nk
It's not anything super-significant but I'm somewhat moved by it
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Post by ScorrchingTheaph on Feb 7, 2021 23:56:18 GMT
so if we agree upon a target to swap with as a complete town we can unionize and collectively bargain with the person we choose by threatening to hang them if they don't pick our agreed upon target if we make this relationship explicit we can get around the whole "the people we 'reward' have agency" problem very totalitarian but very effective Re-skimmed the Past thread, and I feel like there is so much info to be gained from whoever is the lynch that it would greatly alter possible swap/rb targets, which would leave all of the decision making in the hands of the rewarded player. I don't think there is a way to get around this by preplanning a target simply because of the order of vote -> flips -> actions. I do not support this strategy. AZ: too volatile OM: still scum ❓: no selfvoting animalmidwife: possible quojova: possible chaos: just swapped |
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Post by ScorrchingTheaph on Feb 7, 2021 23:57:58 GMT
Preferably we just swap someone ~suspicious~ out so it doesn't become a scum!majority on one side controlling votes and town!majority on the other side trying to trickle in - Animal is currently the one popping into my head w/ that in mind Swap someone suspicious out of tomorrow's lynchpool? |
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Post by ScorrchingTheaph on Feb 8, 2021 0:01:23 GMT
Preferably we just swap someone ~suspicious~ out so it doesn't become a scum!majority on one side controlling votes and town!majority on the other side trying to trickle in - Animal is currently the one popping into my head w/ that in mind Swap someone suspicious out of tomorrow's lynchpool? Also, if your main concern is the thread positioning of players, wouldn't the best option be to opt for a roleblock and not have a swap at all? |
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Post by quojova on Feb 8, 2021 0:01:25 GMT
so if we agree upon a target to swap with as a complete town we can unionize and collectively bargain with the person we choose by threatening to hang them if they don't pick our agreed upon target if we make this relationship explicit we can get around the whole "the people we 'reward' have agency" problem very totalitarian but very effective Re-skimmed the Past thread, and I feel like there is so much info to be gained from whoever is the lynch that it would greatly alter possible swap/rb targets, which would leave all of the decision making in the hands of the rewarded player. I don't think there is a way to get around this by preplanning a target simply because of the order of vote -> flips -> actions. I do not support this strategy. AZ: too volatile OM: still scum ❓: no selfvoting animalmidwife: possible quojova: possible chaos: just swapped well, if the player they are going to kill is clear not too soon before the deadline would could have a town-flip case and a scum-flip case prepared for who we swap with. do you agree with the general plan of swapping with a scummier player like maple or spiderz though? possibly ditch the totalitarian hang-threatening part |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 8, 2021 0:01:32 GMT
Preferably we just swap someone ~suspicious~ out so it doesn't become a scum!majority on one side controlling votes and town!majority on the other side trying to trickle in - Animal is currently the one popping into my head w/ that in mind Swap someone suspicious out of tomorrow's lynchpool? There's no rolling eyes emote on this forum, so please envision me rolling my eyes out of you for such a bad faith question |
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Post by quojova on Feb 8, 2021 0:04:48 GMT
Swap someone suspicious out of tomorrow's lynchpool? Also, if your main concern is the thread positioning of players, wouldn't the best option be to opt for a roleblock and not have a swap at all? very boring  we could do a roleblock but for reasons I've mentioned previously here (https://ps-mafia.proboards.com/post/74464/thread) I think it probably would be better to not discuss the target of the roleblock |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 8, 2021 0:06:27 GMT
Swap someone suspicious out of tomorrow's lynchpool? Also, if your main concern is the thread positioning of players, wouldn't the best option be to opt for a roleblock and not have a swap at all? Loses both sides being able to get a grasp on the player and therefore leaves the game in a stilted portion where ppl only have formulated opinions on half the game due to questions that aren't being asked by the other thread basically - fucking lame, I'm not playing a half game |
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Post by OM~! on Feb 8, 2021 0:07:24 GMT
Swap someone suspicious out of tomorrow's lynchpool? There's no rolling eyes emote on this forum, so please envision me rolling my eyes out of you for such a bad faith question To add onto the bad faithiness of this question, I literally put who I wanted swapped out Shame on you scorrchingtheaph. |
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Post by ScorrchingTheaph on Feb 8, 2021 0:07:28 GMT
Swap someone suspicious out of tomorrow's lynchpool? There's no rolling eyes emote on this forum, so please envision me rolling my eyes out of you for such a bad faith question (serious question) |
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