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Post by cyan on May 2, 2023 4:16:30 GMT
vvv
ForgotToFlush
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Schia, lindauna, scrooch
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termsofservice, aka
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Cyan, clems, ccg
ww
Myan
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zesty/dactyl/sand ftf died n1 by fire. What do we make of this, everyone? vote no vote i got a lot of shit for saying we shouldn't be paying attention to this. if you want to talk about something interesting we can talk about how both of the people giving me shit were killed n2 but i highly doubt flush was the focus for either kill because no one else was talking about his reads late d2/early d3 |
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Post by cyan on May 2, 2023 4:14:09 GMT
i actually think it's quite nice that you're willing to contradict your sub slot with your reads but i do wish you could expand on all of your conclusions instead of shuttling them all out like this Okay. So I really hard read up to page 12, and started to get worried I don't know how long days are. I want to post some sort of contribution. I was taking too long to read, so I skimmed. I will reread hard later. I thought Clemsen was easily seen as scum, as scum you can't really reinact towniness since you have TMI. It's a hard skill to learn and often cracks are shown by small mistakes, such as Clemson being on Myan for a horrible reason, pushing them, but not voting them until they were later called out. Scum naturally want to keep their options open, so I'm assuming that why they pushed but didn't vote them right away. I want to cross reference Theaph, from what I seen they town read Clemson for no reason? I think they also town read akakap? Correct me if I'm wrong, I skimmed day two. I will reread!!! I think the MyanMario push was odd to me personally, only because I personally could tell Myan was trolling in the beginning but recovered when they realized this was not how people were wanting to play. Change in tone basically. Also pmeta on MyanMario since I have been working closely will Myan for months, I could tell they were town. I'm assuming if I remember they died to ice mafia, so most likely ice thought they were fire mafia over the other people on the wagon. I'm trying to understand the thought process there. I really don't understand how I been sided with ice mafia. I am town. But on Clemsen's stating they thought ccgeek/ailura was a t/s. But, never explained their reads on that. They did scum read CCgeek. Meaning ailura was town, but I'm assuming they only did that because Ailura was on them but got off and wanted to keep the vote off of them as long as possible because you know Ailura would def get them. But I want to take notice of that read t/s read as well, I may be overreading things a bit too much, but I really think their push on CCGeek was fake? They only if I remember correctly hopped on the vote when someone else voted them. I feel like they voted their scum partner in a sense to give them some sort of shift off of them being ice mafia. Let's say either of them flipped ( both ice mafia in my eyes ) gives the other lee ( can't spell the word ) way. Most scum know they should vote their partner day one if they are being voted off. To atleast try to give some sort of clear for their partner. If the Clemsen was not voted off and CCGeek was, he would not be seen as ice mafia. Please do tell me if I'm overanyslising this spot!!! I also want to bring notice to Dacty, they were second on Clemsen's vote. And if I remember they scum read him off of one line. I could be paranoid, but they didn't push and then didn't say anything after that. Maybe they thought the wagon would die down later, or the fact they could get early not ice mafia if they flipped. Apparently akakakp flipped. I haven't read the days following into day two that much, so I will update on who I personally think is fire mafia when I read. I just wanted to post something. I realized while reading ailura's reads, I didn't agree with a lot, so I'm sorry if I'm ruining their legacy. They scum read akakap though, while I town read them, but basically because of how they played day one. But I scum read Clemsen, they did not. I feel like I'm in a tight spot at the moment. I want to continue into my reads on who I think is not ice mafia. Cyan Talon is not ice mafia frankly because they got Clemsen right away, and continued to push them. They did not let them go, and saw scum. I also see them as town lean, due them activity contributing in the game and explaining their reads well. They get their point across every post I seen so far. TE is also confirmed not ice mafia and I whole heartily think they are town. Due to their day one interactions with Clemsen. Yes, it was a poor vote on them base-wise, but you can tell TE voted out of pettiness rather than an actually read/push right off the bat, but they later recovered by explaining their read more. This may be a weak read, and is surrounded likely on a mirco read, I'm pretty confident. No way is their scum partner bussing day one so LOUDLY. I will read day two and find my reads on who may be fire mafia, and post more town reads/town leans, but those are the only ones I feel confident at the moment. but i want to highlight angles of discussion i think need to be cleared up in this game: TE not being ice goo is a valid read, and ice goo's reason for killing MyanMario and Schiavetto is pretty much a mystery (were they hunting n1 and fearkilling n2? were they suspecting schia of being scum?) it's at least very clear from the lack of activity that neither kill in d3 was an explicit setup for a vote. |
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Post by cyan on May 2, 2023 4:09:45 GMT
the game is just dead l m a o
ihbst's posts are the definition of bare minimum and their playstyle makes me think they're just really uninvested in scumhunting
and any player who wants to live but doesn't want to say anything outright inflammatory or potent is an instant policy.
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 12:30:47 GMT
Can we talk about how Sylveon is like "don't vote me haha I will isodive haha even though my ISOdives are terrible and barely say anything" Just because you post a big Wallpost doesn't make you town unfortunately for you, honey, i think you bullied sylveon out of the game and the "don't vote me haha" reads town with low self-esteem as much as it reads scum faking activity |
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 12:28:12 GMT
I feel like not really any slots can be fire OR ice, based on wagons, so not really a "mid ground" vote you're just contradicting yourself with every other post atp i feel like you should either get good or get better |
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 12:27:42 GMT
i wanna know the relationship between these two posts, right: - The wagons are the most important info, and its practically confirmed that people on clemens wagon are not ice and people on aka wagon were not fire - The fire kills feel logical, while the ice kills feel impulsive (eg. killing Schiavetto when they were on fire wagon, and MyanMario kill was def weird when they were a semi-major wagon the day before) My main thoughts on gamestate, obviously best vote is probably: 1. someone who wasn't on either scum wagon 2.someone who follows the previously stated kill patterns. Shaun is probably the nullest slot in the game, and would probably be the best option for a vote Ice reads: syv>saygg>shaun>TOS>cyan>dactyl Fire reads: TOS>saygg>shaun>dactyl>cyan>syv idk because i don't see how sayggtome (i.e. lindauna/ailura) is supposed to fit as either impulsive or logical killing scum and it's technically your job to argue that i also want to know what makes you think shaun is a better option than the two slots above them as both alignments |
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 6:09:26 GMT
also you're on thin ice because your slot made an incredibly surface-level isodive (but i'm not bothered to push) termsofservice Shaun-CCGeek ihbst i better hear from you because if i get town mvp at the end of this game i'm choking all three of you with my bare hands |
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 6:07:43 GMT
Hey........ i am here to fill a slot, but i guess since i am here i should try to be a good slot. Someone fill me in? basic game info D1: initial wagons were myanmario/termsofservice, clemensthelemon (我是谁) wagoned next and voted out, flipped ice. shaun-ccgeek was primary counterwagon N1: ftflush killed by fire (flipped doc), myan killed by ice D2: less momentum, no real wagons (biggest piles were on ccgeek, me and sylveon). shift towards akakakp closer to EoD (flipped fire), with scorrchingtheaph as the counterwagon N2: scorr killed by fire, schia killed by ice powerplayers of the game were lindauna and schiavetto (and myself and scorr to a lesser extent). ccgeek and tos remain as semi-actives. ihbst has been kinda low-effort troll |
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 5:46:25 GMT
until then
VOTE: ihbst
awaiting some actual reads so i can drop this read harder than i dropped my dignity
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 5:45:27 GMT
my preliminary thoughts are: lindauna (sayggtome) is NOT fire mafia: akakakp tried to pocket their slot dactyl7 (OM) is UNLIKELY ice mafia: they were the first to vote clemens in a theme where bussing is a bad move + we can assume they were active around n1/d2 Policy pool is [ihbst, ccgeek, quax, om] in that order. see ps-mafia.proboards.com/post/93688/thread for the former BUT our most productive angle of discussion (in my POV) is trying to find out who killed myanmario |
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 5:33:41 GMT
During the night: ❗ subbed in for Sylveon & Rando. OM~! subbed in for Dactyl7. sayggtome subbed in for lindauna. Flips in the next post. but legitimately the fact that we're now in a 1v1v5 with three newbie slots and ihbst as one of the originals is going to hurt us terribly i am begging you here, please cook |
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Post by cyan on May 1, 2023 5:32:02 GMT
Howdy, I'm subbing in for Ailura. This is my first fourm game, and I will be playing primarily on mobile until I reach my computer. I will be rereading the game from page one. I want to make sure this is known, my opinions may not align with whom I am subbing in for depending on if I noticed something they did not, or I frankly don't agree with what they expressed. unfortunately for you, your slot was packing serious heat and you're going to need a lot of work to catch up to its legacy also get a pfp so we can distinguish you from the rest of the goons |
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Post by cyan on Apr 30, 2023 3:46:27 GMT
tl;dr aka's push on dactyl is just an aim at low-hanging fruit
so my point about them having given up on the game (but not in a "i can't play this anymore" type like sylveon because they clearly still intend to survive) stands stronger for it
i'd say "dactyl can't be partnered with akakakp" but i am also arguing that no one can so god forbid!
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Post by cyan on Apr 30, 2023 3:44:12 GMT
Bussing D1 in this theme is so negative ev. Why would he ever do that? the read itself is a surface-level "dactyl wasn't trying to get clemens voted and was just on it for towncred" if that framing makes it look any better but speaking of not trying to get people voted, ironically i think aka is doing the same here with the push on dactyl and what tips me off is their progression on the read itself back to this post: cyan is way too head over heels for the clemens push for me to think it's a town push currently
his whole iso is pushing clems lol
also he doesnt show much flexibility in a multiball game
i think cyan genuinely believes he found a scum in clem
i just think cyan is scum too
dactyl had more posts than i remembered
i think he's worse than ccgeek
ccgeek hasnt rlly contributed much but is tonally pure
dactyl worse by those metrics
saving clems for ccgeek means i have to watch cyan push him nonstop d2 again
Most significant thing I can gain from FTF's iso is that they were one of two people who had SR'd Cyan (the other being Schia iirc) and likely would have pushed Cyan if they were alive. They were also literally the only person to say something about Dactyl and said thing was an SR. Personally I think Dactyl is more likely to be aligned with Clem since Clem had a lot of pushback to everyone who voted them except for Dact and does not have Dact present in their readslist (seen here) But either way I think one of Cyan/Dact flips scum. what i want to highlight here is (as indicated in cyan) that their read on dactyl, in a single post and seemingly without the connective tissue needed to make this coherent or reasonable, aka nudged towards the idea of Fire!Dactyl and Ice!Dactyl as part of a single mini-case leads me to believe aka just wants dactyl voted. inb4 "couldn't aka have just mistaken the kill sources?" doubtful. Good morning! Myan kill is wacky. I thought for sure that was Clemens' partner. o7 FTF will read your iso shortly Vote: Dactyl |
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Post by cyan on Apr 30, 2023 3:31:36 GMT
there seems to have been a misunderstanding: tos and akakakp aren't slots who look scummy with ftf dead, they're slots whose push would be easier if ftf was dead. killing ftf would be the removal of an obstacle, not a step in the intended direction also i was disregarding myself in that statement so i should probably concede that ftf's death makes my push harder and you're free to take that what you will. the question schia raised was what push scum would find easier with flush out of the picture and unless scum wanted to imply that i killed flush (which in that case would point towards akakakp)i'd do an iso dive of akakakp myself but sylv was offering and having the isos posted is just generally a good thing for visibility so i'll just sit here and wait what so let me just set things straight here because i feel like i'm speaking in a different channel while addressing the post where i said ftf's read wall wasn't worth looking into, you raised this point: in other news, i refuse to believe performing nka on ftf's read wall is going to be productive discussion. for what it's worth the lurker slots they pointed out appear to be here in-game, but if anyone wants to start an ihbst/dactyl wagon they have to conclusively show that we have no better options Don't like the bolded, i think there are for sure reasons why someone might not want to use his readlist as a point of ingress for reading around the NK, but i think there are also definitely reasons why someone might at least give it some consideration in their solving today & it icks me a bit that you don't even give a justification. Like, otoh, like scorr & i said, it was a very spongy readlist - otoh, it condensed several thoughts that had been floated into thread (for example, my W read on you) while also lending steam to yday's day-end. It's also worth considering who was being townread by Flush, too - or whose mislunch would be made easier by a flush kill. I'm of two minds re: policy lims here, esp. considering DL changes. Think the "no better options" bit would track better for me if both teams were down to one.
in my reply, i tried to answer the question myself to see where the resulting discussion would lead: that if fire mafia wanted to use flush's kill to make a misvote easier, their day target would've probably been tos/akakakp (tos in particular here, as they weren't playing very actively d1) on the flipside, if fire maf killed flush to set up a frame, then the day targets would be me and ccgeek. akakakp is implied in the former (but it's a weak read and i more strongly believe akakakp is ice here) for being the only slot to bring up flush's readwall on their initial vote against me, and the read wall is clearly not the driving force behind the ccgeek pus |
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Post by cyan on Apr 30, 2023 3:20:09 GMT
on reconsideration maybe "ccgeek is playing passive, fire mafia is acting passive so ccgeek must be fire mafia" isn't as strong of a read as i initially thought i'm staying on mainly because they promised content and i don't like people who promise content until they properly deliver for now, i'm just going to shuttle off random thoughts and continue discussioni did say it was surface level. generally i think akakakp was calling a lot of attention onto clemens yesterday and the thought that struck me was "would scum actively defend and buddy their partner that blatantly?" but with the post you pointed out earlier i think it's more likely that akakakp was simping for some inexplicable reason and trying to find that would be severely unproductive right, but we have no grasp on what fire mafia were playing at by killing ftf and until we do it's just not something i think is worth working out if we work surface-level and assume that flush's reads (and the general consensus they represent, sans the read on me) were a threat to scum, that's an immediate path to a WIFOM "but flush could've been killed to frame the scumslots!" argument it just stands out to me that for what it's worth, i think flush's death should be written off as fearkill until we get something that points us in a different direction but for the sake of engagement let me also address your latter avenue of discussion: if you think fire maf wanted to set up a misvote by killing flush, i'd say the most viable pool of misvote targets is between termsofservice and akakakp. anyone higher in the list is just not getting voted either way and anyone lower doesn't need flush to get the push running. i'm just a staunch believer that policy kills are the lazy option; we do them when nothing better stands out. i've probably been conditioned to the frequency of policy-viable players in chat mafia and the relatively common trend of scum catching on and policying them in turn oh wow, what a surprise, both your random thoughts are @ me |
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Post by cyan on Apr 29, 2023 1:53:03 GMT
i should emphasise my key points in cyan text in the future
but before i make that a habit, is anyone in this forum using light mode?
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Post by cyan on Apr 29, 2023 1:52:14 GMT
Okay a lot of aka's post seem to pretend to be contributing. Will cover this more in my ISO Dive. cyan you can post your ISO dive, idrc. it's... ps-mafia.proboards.com/post/93670/threadhere also considering the "pretend to be contributing" bit is a different direction than what i pulled out of it i'm just going to say that i need your isodive to progress the game |
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Post by cyan on Apr 29, 2023 1:48:36 GMT
we really need to talk about how akakakp just complimented two slots today (i.e. calling them super town) and what they had in common was that both slots were sring them.
FTF already said it better than me but the way lin's posts are constructed are super townie. Easy to read, lots of solid evidence, and just the right amount of townie paranoia/indecision. As for the vote switching I thought it would be fun to see what kind of reactions I could get out of Clemens and possibly some other players. Cleared CCGeek from being ice mafia as you and Cyan already stated. Could you elaborate on the Scorr TR? They hopped on the CC wagon with me and Clems so I am surprised you didn't mention that. Editing quotes is hard on mobile so I just won’t but @linduana i in no way “deflected” from your accusation and painting that picture feels super malicious. I addressed your point head on while also asking for clarification on another part of the post. Not sold on this slot being town anymore. Cyan and Scorr had a super productive discussion and Cyan feels super town from it but for some reason I’m not getting that vibe from Scorr. Wish I could explain but something just feels off.
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Post by cyan on Apr 28, 2023 15:13:54 GMT
Votecount 2.1 If the day were to end now, Sylveon & Rando would be eliminated.
lindauna is currently voting me btw just putting that out there |
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Post by cyan on Apr 28, 2023 15:13:36 GMT
but here's a status update: currently the slots of concern to me right now are akakakp (which i noticed while skimming their iso earlier) and sylveon (for reasons already stated). and disclaimer: i do not hard scumread these two but i am very willing to vote one and am slightly willing to vote the other A. akakakp: did i say i was going to isodive? well i'm going to post snippets to get my point across instead what struck me as weird about akakakp's play progression is how they started out probing semi-actively into key posts during early day 1, like so: it's 8 AM and i have some Serious Thoughts - clem v. myan seems to be a big cross and it's entirely driven by clem's single-minded push on them BUT clem has yet to place the vote - clem is partly shitposting and partly trying to hold other members to a higher standard (see: "that last line was really sus", "i need people to describe their playstyle", getting pissed at CCGeek (or was it TE?) faux-calling the PL motherfuckers) - and a bigger point: clem's higher effort posts don't actually delve into who might be scum/town and just. look. i dunno what kinda vibes are we getting out of "i need all the newer players to describe their playstyle" Vote 我是谁 but also this quote makes me wonder, actually: is it likely myan and clem are buddies and clem is forcing distance after this fallout? Not a fan of the above two posts from Cyan. We are not very far into the game whatsoever and it feels like you're trying to exaggerate the conflict between Clemens and Myan in order to secure them as FoS for today -- which is also seen in the next quote where you try to cement "Clemens is the vote today" after what only 4 pages? i'm back and i have a few thoughts. this is post 1 where i casebuild and get this over with my stance on clemens has not changed. i firmly believe that their fervent push on myan adds up to jack shit and they're aware of it like come on! this screams so much like "look at me, i'm doing what town does, i'm pursuing a scumread" and they haven't repeated any of the two (flimsy) points they made in their past few posts. and in case we all need a reminder i'm going to just let the actual reasoning behind the myan wagon sit on its own pedestal for all of us to admire: this isn't a read complex enough to warrant the kind of defensiveness clemens has been playing with these past few days. clemens is the vote of the day and if someone wants to contest it on grounds other than "Player X is a better vote" i'd like you to address all of clemens's recent posts when you do that and if you're wondering what i think after all of this, myan + clemens remains my bet for one of the scumteams. imagine i sponged schia's read again (if you missed it, it's clemens's "hey are you actually parked on myan" post before they went on this micrograin of a push), but also match it up with how myan has largely just... ignored the otherwise fairly large pressure on them and continued to play passively However I love the callout of Clemens being LAMIST, I can understand it completely from a town pov and said callout was the result of getting Clemens to react to Cyan. So while I don't love how Cyan went about approaching the Clemens push, if Clemens is scum it seemed to have worked out perfectly. Whether or not Clemens is actually scum I am unsure. I believe they said in their intro that they look scummy all the time and it's true, they do, so I am trying to give them some benefit of the doubt. Really not a fan of these last few lines from clemens as it neither engages with the game state nor directly addresses valid lines of inquiry from other players. The vote on Myan to avoid an SR for how hard they pushed is scummy, I feel the discussion about new players is quite NAI. Hoping Clemens can elaborate more on the Myan read beyond apparent OMGUS and one "sus line" ("next person to talk is scum and ill tunnel em tomorrow" - reads troll rather than scum). Think Clemens scum indicative here.
Clemens is pushing too hard on Myan but also needs to elaborate more on their read? How is voting their scumread trying to avoid getting SR'd? Not sure i'm following. Briefly addressing CCGeek here, I disagree with Clemen's statement that CCGeek's one line interactions with the game indicate distancing from Myan. Myan has stated "shaun seems fake af- either that or theyre awkward, lmk!". Seems like a genuine push as CCGeek lines read low effort attempts at gathering information on who's in the game and getting engagement from afks. However, they do seem new so i'll wait for more posts from this slot first.
unvote: spiderz vote: 我是谁 Do you think Myan is town then? Tos feels town. The nature of this quote just reads as super genuine: In order to help me decide I compiled everything I think about Myan and Clems: Myan: -avoiding crossing with Clemens (if Clemens flips scum then this is scummy, if they flip town this is NAI) -Mildly SRing two people yet staying on me, who is Null according to them (y'all gotta help me decide if this is NAI or scum) Clemens: -hardpushing Myan, only saying if others are town/scum without saying why (scummy) -Myan push feels forced (scummy) Especially the "y'all gotta help me decide this" part. Mwah. Unvote: termsofserviceVote: ClemensClemens explain your reads and convince us that you're town like your life depends on it but then their play quality took a nosedive and all of a sudden they were acting to save clemens (or at the very least pursue the counterwagons) at every turn in what seems to be a complete 180 from any stance implied by their ealier posts Unvote: ClemensVote: CCGeekClemens vote with me Congratulations Everyone For you’ve made it Just in time for THE PIVOTTTTTTT VOTE CCGEEK FOR FREE TOWNCRED Sad to see Clemens go. Maybe they will flip but considering they are our most active player and we have 2 players who have not moved their vote since RVS and 1 who hasn't even voted at all, I would really prefer to keep playing with them and not let this game die. One of those players who hasn't moved their vote is CCGeek. Could be town for not voting on the Clemens or Myan wagons but I have TR'd scum for that too many times before and have started to realize that usually that passivity is more scum!indicative than town!indicative. and since then (i.e., during D2), they've rubberbanded into "i thought clemens and myan were scum together" (which calls into question why they would want to leave clemens alive, but given the activity mourning that's neither here nor there" and have spent the majority of d2 explaining their d1 play Damn, scum rlly got doctor n1 ;; It's a bit late for me right now, so I'll list my thoughts here and follow up in the morning. So far I think from interactions with flipped scum CCGeek is possible town, definitely not ice mafia due to the Clemens vanity. Also kind of funny scum hit Myan (who was, at that point, one of the major SRs from D1). Scorr is the only strong town read I can see so far. On the other hand, these are a few slots I'd like to look further into as potential SRs: 1. Schiavetto - they've been rather skeptical so far which I liked, and their reads seemed solid. However their interactions with Clemens and simultaneous push on Cyan strikes me as a bit strange. With the Myan flip and their late ish vote on the Clemens wagon at a point he was almost universally scumread makes me reconsider if they're town. They also made a comment about how Cyan could be scum of an opposing faction to Clemens which seems like TMI for me. 2. Akakakp - Constant vote shifting from Clemens to CCGeek to MyanMario, was this an attempt to save Clemens by voting a weaker SR? Their posts and tone are fine, I just don't understand the triple shift here and I feel this could be a potential Clemens partner. 3. Cyan Talon - A lot of their reads seem to stem from a single interaction between Schiavetto and Clemens, and most of their interactions so far have been with schia if I'm not mistaken. I feel Schia and Cyan is a potential s/t or s/s cross. Their tunnel and inquiries to myself and responses to Schia seem genuine, but their alignment remains ambiguous. I'll be back with hopefully more content in the morning, gn FTF already said it better than me but the way lin's posts are constructed are super townie. Easy to read, lots of solid evidence, and just the right amount of townie paranoia/indecision. As for the vote switching I thought it would be fun to see what kind of reactions I could get out of Clemens and possibly some other players. Cleared CCGeek from being ice mafia as you and Cyan already stated. Could you elaborate on the Scorr TR? They hopped on the CC wagon with me and Clems so I am surprised you didn't mention that. Running back through, kinda torn on this - I think the train of thought behind that second half is villagery at a glance, has elements of reflection w/ sound conclusion & intent-to-action that track as townie, but the first half is kind of weird. It feels kind of off to lament the Clem wagon on the basis of his activity without also considering the circumstances of that activity (he got noticeably more vocal/finicky after I & others put pressure on his slot, and into phase-end) but there's also this idea that, like... it puts the onus of game activity on the scummy slot without taking time to evaluate if that's Villagery activity or Wolfy activty, and completely sails past the consideration that other players might pick up the slack (which is a perspective idt is consistent with other players' stated opinions on the stale threadstate) like, functionally it feels like a wolf trying to swing momentum away from a partner
I get that but I was struggling to read Clemens definitively since a lot of the 'scummy' things they did were things that they had pointed out as natural behavior for them. I also don't think I would be wrong in saying that a Clemens town flip would be pretty atrocious for us considering there wasn't any other wagon that went to E-1. The part about Clemens' activity being increased after pressure I did not notice but that is also a natural reaction that I would expect any townie to have. I also made the post you quoted 2 hours before the deadline so there was no momentum to be swung. Overall I can definitely see how it could fit into the mold of a Clem partner but the general idea of my end of day pushes was not based on Clemens but rather based on trying to catch some bad reactions. Was it worth it? A little bit. Would I do it again? Definitely >  if i had to guess what this play approach implies about akakakp, it's that i vaguely believe they lost motivation to play some time in late d1 or during n1.
if anyone remembers the surface level read where i (implicitly) argued akakakp couldn't be in a scumteam with clemens because of the very vocal and blatant "hey let's leave Clemens alive guys" deal? i'm fully retracting that and arguing that: akakakp is a candidate for Ice Goo who was forced into a severely disadvantageous position and stopped playing around the time their partner's fate was sealed.
this read conflicts with my earlier statements where i said if fire mafia wanted to frame me akakakp was the best candidate. the basis for that was this post: cyan is way too head over heels for the clemens push for me to think it's a town push currently
his whole iso is pushing clems lol
also he doesnt show much flexibility in a multiball game
i think cyan genuinely believes he found a scum in clem
i just think cyan is scum too
dactyl had more posts than i remembered
i think he's worse than ccgeek
ccgeek hasnt rlly contributed much but is tonally pure
dactyl worse by those metrics
saving clems for ccgeek means i have to watch cyan push him nonstop d2 again
Most significant thing I can gain from FTF's iso is that they were one of two people who had SR'd Cyan (the other being Schia iirc) and likely would have pushed Cyan if they were alive. They were also literally the only person to say something about Dactyl and said thing was an SR. Personally I think Dactyl is more likely to be aligned with Clem since Clem had a lot of pushback to everyone who voted them except for Dact and does not have Dact present in their readslist (seen here) But either way I think one of Cyan/Dact flips scum. where akakakp explicitly makes the "ftf sred cyan and dactyl and it was a hot take so cyan and dactyl might be scum" argument (although the latter is in conflict with the argument that clemens and dactyl were likely aligned, and said argument is also just extremely weak) to conclude: i'm putting my foot where my mouth is. VOTE: akakakp
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Post by cyan on Apr 28, 2023 14:48:50 GMT
lindauna i will echo TE's sentiment about having better post organisation because holy shit. responses in cyanThis is probably going to be my longest post yet as I came back to 2 pages of discussion, so I'll begin where I left off in my last post, where I said we should look further into Schiavetto, Akakakp, and Cyan Talon. This is Aka's response, which deflects rather than addressing the points brought up. I'll probably follow this up when someone posts the iso.
FTF already said it better than me but the way lin's posts are constructed are super townie. Easy to read, lots of solid evidence, and just the right amount of townie paranoia/indecision. As for the vote switching I thought it would be fun to see what kind of reactions I could get out of Clemens and possibly some other players. Cleared CCGeek from being ice mafia as you and Cyan already stated. Could you elaborate on the Scorr TR? They hopped on the CC wagon with me and Clems so I am surprised you didn't mention that. I'm not sure what Aka gains by buddying me here, but their response here is strange. I mentioned my reason for the SR to be constant vote shifting post RVS, yet they instead direct attention to the Scorr read. Scorr was on ToS, a slot that went from being unhelpful to being townie and I see no issue with their shift. Scorr was also the only player to townread Clemens, which would be a very strange play indeed if they were scum. I feel Scor's responses D1 and D2 come from a foundation of solid reasoning.
Your vote shifts, on the other hand, didn't seem to be backed by the same amount of reasoning. I fail to understand why Aka would bandwagon Clemens only to shift to Myan, but with the subsequent Myan kill i feel this is too scummy to be scum. I dislike the deflection and lack of engagement with my inquiry here. Hope someone posts an iso dive on this, thanks.
context for the original post: akakakp's reply here is addressing the post where lindauna gives us their d2 scumpool. "deflection" really isn't the best way to summarise the reply mainly because you can't argue a point against someone and expect them to do anything but attempt to justify their actions (or concede, but who does that?) - akakakp does that here.
i do think the post itself is worth discussing, and i'll get to it in my upcoming post
everything from this point onwards consists solely of my responses to lindauna. if you wish to consider it the bulk of my activity, um... please don't?on reconsideration maybe "ccgeek is playing passive, fire mafia is acting passive so ccgeek must be fire mafia" isn't as strong of a read as i initially thought i'm staying on mainly because they promised content and i don't like people who promise content until they properly deliver for now, i'm just going to shuttle off random thoughts and continue discussioni did say it was surface level. generally i think akakakp was calling a lot of attention onto clemens yesterday and the thought that struck me was "would scum actively defend and buddy their partner that blatantly?" but with the post you pointed out earlier i think it's more likely that akakakp was simping for some inexplicable reason and trying to find that would be severely unproductive right, but we have no grasp on what fire mafia were playing at by killing ftf and until we do it's just not something i think is worth working out if we work surface-level and assume that flush's reads (and the general consensus they represent, sans the read on me) were a threat to scum, that's an immediate path to a WIFOM "but flush could've been killed to frame the scumslots!" argument it just stands out to me that for what it's worth, i think flush's death should be written off as fearkill until we get something that points us in a different direction but for the sake of engagement let me also address your latter avenue of discussion: if you think fire maf wanted to set up a misvote by killing flush, i'd say the most viable pool of misvote targets is between termsofservice and akakakp. anyone higher in the list is just not getting voted either way and anyone lower doesn't need flush to get the push running. i'm just a staunch believer that policy kills are the lazy option; we do them when nothing better stands out. i've probably been conditioned to the frequency of policy-viable players in chat mafia and the relatively common trend of scum catching on and policying them in turn Not sure why Cyan is so insistent on not relying on FtF's iso, a lot of Cyan's more recent posts are centered around his own slot in the game, or aimed to justify why scum would behave in a particular way. I can't see many of these lines coming from a townie perspective. i'm really just speaking from experience (source: trust me bro) that using the readwalls of a recently killed player to say "X is scum because [dead] SR'd them" is very wifommy and not productive. schia pointed out a different way to use flush's readwall by suggesting that certain players would be easier to push with flush out of the picture, which i tried to develop in my followup.
for the most part i just see flush as a prominent forum mafia figure and it's more than likely their death was just a fearkill because the lack of direction anywhere today suggests otherwiseI feel like you are very biased in saying saying that, because if one were to perform nka on ftf's read wall they may come to the conclusion that you are in the scumpool. vvv
ForgotToFlush
vv
Schia, lindauna, scrooch
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termsofservice, aka
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Cyan, clems, ccg
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Myan
n
zesty/dactyl/sand I don't think anyone aside from possibly schia was pr reading ftf, and Schia would've benefitted from Ftf being alive since he was one of the strongest listed trs. If we were to say it was a fearkill, it would leave Cyan, CCG, Myan. Trying to default a vote onto one of the low posters feels like a very mediocre play from town especially since there is momentum from D1 ice vote. This line of analysis really reads town to me tbh, I like the response to Cyan coupled with the reasoning on who we should vote - I feel directing a wagon onto Dactyl/ihbst is very suboptimal townplay and Cyan really stands out as the scummiest player right now. A lot of their lines read Engagement for the Sake of Engagement, there was absolutely no reason to push a vote onto an inactive slot. i wasn't suggesting we push a vote onto an inactive? that was scorch's own input (my SoD vote was ccgeek)first of all, i'm manually and artificially spoilering this quote to make it easier for the rest of us to digest.and my thoughts? like i know this isn't IIoA but does anyone else feel like this iso dive is a little... non-committal? it kind of feels like sylv is just reacting individually to lines and talking about how scummy they are. my definition of scumhunting is looking at the posts and trying to find out what the poster is attempting to achieve, and this is not that feel free to call me out if i'm looking at this wrong, but sylveon comes off to me as someone who either thinks they're scumhunting or is faking scumhunting but if we're talking about the post itself: the conclusion these points are leading me to is that ccgeek is playing in bad faith and refusing to engage with the gameand while i'm all gung-ho about getting them killed for that alone, i'm really not sold on how these points suggest ccgeek is outright scum I really dislike this line where they're for getting sylveon killed over the iso dive post, their lines here once again read Engagement for the Sake of Engagement. Not sure why they're backtracking on their ccgeek SR post from the start of the day to SR sylveon. Would appreciate if Cyan can respond to these inquiries. Another pattern I've noticed is that Cyan's SRs were all wagons started by someone else - their entire read on Clemens originated from an interaction where schia called out an atrocious response from the latter, and their post on CCGeek appear to originate from my D1 SR. They also had strange interactions with CCGeek which I'd like to talk about in another post. i'll need you to define Engagement for the Sake of Engagement for us because if i were to use my interpretation of it then Sylveon would be the most guilty person of it in the entire thread for reasons i have previously outlined
as for why i'm not going for CCGeek, well... they say pressure isn't pressure if you call it pressure (i'll get to that in a moment)there seems to have been a misunderstanding: tos and akakakp aren't slots who look scummy with ftf dead, they're slots whose push would be easier if ftf was dead. killing ftf would be the removal of an obstacle, not a step in the intended direction also i was disregarding myself in that statement so i should probably concede that ftf's death makes my push harder and you're free to take that what you will. the question schia raised was what push scum would find easier with flush out of the picture and unless scum wanted to imply that i killed flush (which in that case would point towards akakakp) i'd do an iso dive of akakakp myself but sylv was offering and having the isos posted is just generally a good thing for visibility so i'll just sit here and wait Again very contradictory, why are they now shifting to another slot sred by myself and schia? I feel the entire cyan talon iso lacks true scumhunting intent and is focused on the FtF flip and its implications, going over slots that have been hard SRed by other players, and ultimately making contributions for the sake of having something to say. is it not natural to just pursue the most recent clues for discussion because they tend to be more relevant and easier to read through? i'm not trying to play hyper-actively here for, well, mental constraints - but saying my contributions are "for the sake of having something to say" is a bit of a minefield statement
please check my d1 push on clemens because while i do admit that schia's post is what clicked it in my mind i wasn't putting in the legwork to spell it out solely so i could look active (my push on clemens was almost solely focused on their LAMIST so how's that)
and if you want me to play like that now... well, i have thoughts and i'll get to those!publicly declaring that if sylv doesn't do the akakakp isodive in 10-ish hours i'm going to do it myself i'm not too concerned about getting it out ASAP because all i really have to say is: there's a big disconnect with how akakakp was playing in the early stages of Day 1 and how they were playing from late D1 onwards (when the Clemens vote took up traction), and while i find it weird i can't tie it to explicitly scummy motives the best i can actually do in that regard is "akakakp is framing me, help!" and those are not the depths i will sink to No idea how cyan can't tie anything to scummy motives, I'm having a hard time seeing how they've sred at least 3 slots at this point yet remain parked on CCGeek, despite calling out the sylveon iso dive as articifical scumhunting. They also had this line in a later post: "i'm not ashamed to admit that yes! asking everyone to disregard this pool would be kinda good for me since ftf was one of two people pushing me d1" I feel that town has no reason to disregard a potential scumpool simply because they're an SR, a lot of the content coming from this slot is wishy-washy and lacks solid justification. Not a fan of how shifty they have been either, this is my vote for the day. Vote: Cyan Talon
Looking for the akakakp iso dive before I comment further on this slot. I'm pretty sure schia and scorr are town here, cyan is my strongest SR. Aka and CCGeek are potential scum but I'll revisit this in a while. Refraining from comment on ToS and Sylv for now as they have made limited contributions. Lastly, I would like to see more interactions from ihbst and dactyl as these slots have been pretty much absent from the discourse so far, as Schia said we are in need of more town clears.
i'm just going to say it straight here: you're assuming that any slots i call into questions are my solid hard reads. i don't have that level of self-confidence 99% of the time and i will resort to just listing out my best leads so everyone can throw in their two cents
if you wanted me to distill my interpretation of your case on me into one idea (which i assume many of the readers here would want): the big issue with my slot is a lack of commitment to reads and a hypercommitment to specific posts (here, primarily the ftf read wall and the ccgeek isodive). honestly all i can really say is that i just normally play like that until a lead forms by itself. part of me just wants to be arrested for this but i do want to ask: if your conclusion is that i am more focused on activity over content and therefore am scum, would that change significantly if i were to push someone with the same vigour i did clemens? and if not, how would these actions tie me to a scum alignment (and which one, since i did basically forget about that bit for all of d1)? Before the sylveon wagon becomes a wagon can we let them post the iso. I'm not really reading this slot as scum, more of suboptimal interactions IE vote before analysis, overanalysis of iso, but there's some valid content in between. As a newer player I can see town doing this in an attempt to make meaningful contribution, I'd like to see them come up with some substantial reads and iso dives before this becomes a wagon. unfortunately the "meaningful contribution" part of your analysis doesn't stick out to me very well primarily because sylv is choosing to focus on ccgeek, a slot who was already very strongly suspected in d1 and has done itself no favours d2 like for what it's worth ccgeek is low-hanging fruit at this point and, oh wait Unvote Shaun-CCGeek
their responses convey a lack of effort that no amount of pressure is going to kickstart so i'm going to drop the read and start waffling Key takeaway here should be that Sylveon and CCGeek cannot be partners.Welcome to today's episode of I want to log off and sub out Today I'll be doing a big fucking read wall Sylveon's reactions are shitty, they are acting like they're conf town for making a big post that consists of them saying the same thing over and over again Schia and Linduana's wallposts are something I dislike, I think they should split stuff up more and actively push people rather than simply making a big post about why someone is scum then disappearing, I'd like it more if they tried to ask questions and get answers CCGeek and akakakp are fillery yes but I don't mind and don't think that's scummy as for TE, well... i kind of find their low-effort play townie by tone? but at the same time they really aren't committing to any original reads and that sucks balls
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Post by cyan on Apr 28, 2023 4:34:09 GMT
sorry cyan, i'm trying but quoting is more tedious than on MS, at least I cannot find a multiquote feature. is there one on here?" "select post" on the relevant quotes and hit reply, they'll pop up in the post previewer |
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Post by cyan on Apr 28, 2023 4:08:31 GMT
publicly declaring that if sylv doesn't do the akakakp isodive in 10-ish hours i'm going to do it myself
i'm not too concerned about getting it out ASAP because all i really have to say is: there's a big disconnect with how akakakp was playing in the early stages of Day 1 and how they were playing from late D1 onwards (when the Clemens vote took up traction), and while i find it weird i can't tie it to explicitly scummy motives
the best i can actually do in that regard is "akakakp is framing me, help!" and those are not the depths i will sink to
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Post by cyan on Apr 28, 2023 4:05:50 GMT
@sylv doing an ISO dive but leaving out an info-post is an interesting decision. Pulling an OMGUS Vote: Sylveon & Rando just for the lols, but seriously though, my TLs right now are aka, ailura, scorr and ihbst, in that order. (if anyone asks me why ihbst, just look at ps-mafia.proboards.com/post/93633). I am not sure what to think of cyan, schia as of now. TE should exist more. Re:sub, I meant whether Dactyl is gonna get subbed out or no, he hasn't posted about in 3 days with a total of 4 in his ISO, but i guess not yet. once again, cyansplaining time: you should quote the info-post in your reply so we can see what was supposed to be there, or at least talk about its contents whichever post by ihbst you were trying to link to, the link you posted doesn't lead to it. (don't edit your original post, just make a new one) thanks for the readlist but. like. is it too hard to ask you to try |
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