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Post by ScorrchingTheaph on Jun 20, 2020 21:45:42 GMT
Does being the first one to talk make you a tr? Personally speaking, I don't think I have ever posted first as mafia. |
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Post by ToiletBro2 on Jun 20, 2020 23:24:12 GMT
Does being the first one to talk make you a tr? Personally speaking, I don't think I have ever posted first as mafia. They mean no |
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Post by ForgotToFlush on Jun 20, 2020 23:30:17 GMT
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Post by spiderz on Jun 21, 2020 0:01:25 GMT
oh woah woah no can we shift off gary and onto micro please?
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Post by Gary The Savage on Jun 21, 2020 0:20:29 GMT
I wanna hear from micro. We haven't gotten much since those half-hearted reads hours ago.
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Post by dudeplayz25 on Jun 21, 2020 0:27:11 GMT
Why are you guys on gts?
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Post by AlmostZero on Jun 21, 2020 0:27:55 GMT
Yikes moment from me when the GTS wagon built up while I was gone. battler444 seems to just be repeating what everyone else has been saying, but I appreciate that there's effort trying to help town. Not enough for me yet though and the BW + reasoning that was just reiterated gets a scumlean from me. ? had a point about how PRs could possibly outed which idt is very common but idt it would be that difficult for scum to do either, they just need a bit of POE, a bit of reading, and a bit of luck to hit a pr. I'm still pro-hypo for now (did i contradict myself there, not really sure) but for others trying to make a decision about hypoing in particular idt you should rule out the risks as non-factors. Not totally set on this right now, so if anyone has anything to say to change my mind, please feel free to do so. Sky actually brings up a good point @ battler. I quite like the fact that sky went out of his way to focus on someone other than the people who are town's focus right now. Concerning the hypo, Scorchie's plan of people hypo'ing "X targeted [dead person]" and "X did not target [dead person]" more or less fixes the problems, as it changes tracker to be more cop-esque role. It doesn't eliminate all the problems, but for the most part it seems good enough to be used! |
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Post by AlmostZero on Jun 21, 2020 0:34:57 GMT
Also, battler isn't someone I like either making a read on me, saying this is scum cuz it isn't a blatant read and not speaking on anything else. @almost Zero I'm a little curious how my lynch was "off" and that I only did it for "towncred" given this and my following post. Also if you're gonna tell me you played with me on main before and "it just wasn't the same" I'm honestly disappointed. I'm getting town vibes from you but it feels like you're just gambling then tunnel vision praying that random reasons will make you right. It seems like your reasoning for battler is a one-liner which is "battler is SR'ing me because I'm not a blatant read" (I'm really sorry but I'm not quite sure what you mean by this line eitherway, I'm guessing your reason is sorta like the one sky has?) Honestly, your reasoning seemed weak and flimsy, and the fact that as of the battler lynch the SR on battler was the one of the only substantial things you've said in the entire game was off-putting, given the pressure you were under. Also I'm not quite sure how I disappointed you, but that's fine. Disappointment, happiness, anger - they are all just a part of life. We'll get used to it. And lastly, "tunnel vision praying that a random reason will make you right" mate. My lynch isn't even on you. Trust me, I'm not digging a you lynch. |
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Post by AlmostZero on Jun 21, 2020 0:37:08 GMT
This is a super good point, the thing that I don't like about Vig though is him major pushing Micro, but not commenting on Tb2 which was like ehhh to me and it gave me Vig + Tb2 with micro traitor vibes, esp with micros dumb TR's on vig and tb2 in partic. Id say that micro is probably a more timid player so I don't think he targets his mafia partners as traitor. tb2's posts are so unreadable, if u wanna point to specific things for me to strain my eyes and read to comment on i can do that What do you think of TB2 in general? Yeah his posts might not exactly be entertaining, but what can you do /shrug |
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Post by AlmostZero on Jun 21, 2020 0:38:47 GMT
Personally speaking, I don't think I have ever posted first as mafia. They mean no Uh Huh? Who is they here? Is they Scorchie? Because "I don't think I have ever posted first as mafia" is not a no to the question "is posting first towny?" |
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Post by AlmostZero on Jun 21, 2020 0:39:16 GMT
Hey Scorchie-chan, what's up? |
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blurb
Innocent Child
ball so hard
Posts: 92 
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Post by blurb on Jun 21, 2020 1:14:47 GMT
blurb's observations made in limited time: despite all these messages said, we have no info to go off of to make scumreads. i read AlmostZero's post, but I don't think it furthers the game or helps us get anywhere. my best direction currently would be to poke or lynch lurkers in order for them to do something xd ok i'll pop in tomorrow to see if anything changed. sl on scorch because i thought he was a serious player edit: ok nvm we have 8 pages ignore everything i said i will make a new post
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Post by Gary The Savage on Jun 21, 2020 1:21:42 GMT
Aight so last post before I go to sleep. Spiderz is a tr, tb2 is bad town. Micro, Cyan, Battler all scum leans. Almost Zero only took half of what I've been saying potentially using kt to their advantage. Vigvig and toni are dead. Scorr is a town lean. People like Cayden, dudeplayz and mystery all foggy. I'm ready to wake up to be tagged 3000 times on all of these. If micro and battler can give reads I'd appreciate that. Sky just keep being there ig. Peace  |
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Post by skyfigueroa on Jun 21, 2020 1:22:21 GMT
Gonna unlynch gary lynch micro for now because of wagon build up I think came out of nowhere. It is a bit weird to me though because I think if scum was gonna bw onto town, they would've had better cases against other users like TB2 or micro and wouldve lynch accordingly. Granted, it could've just been because Gary looked like he was gaining a little traction a few hours ago so they could've gone for it. Just woke up so I'll come back in a few to try and read it again and make sense of it. Also other stuff to take note of: we're still missing some players who have yet to confirm activity, but blurb came in right out off the gates with our TR shennanigans which resulted in some town leans from certain people, but we're yet to see a 2nd line from him. Would like to see more activity esp from him rn considering his start of the game getting on some people's good sides already. |
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blurb
Innocent Child
ball so hard
Posts: 92
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Post by blurb on Jun 21, 2020 1:25:30 GMT
I understand why people sr gts, and I would hop on the wagon if it hadn't built up too much already. battler's reason for lynching gts is suspect. I also think literally any dude interaction makes 0 sense. dudeplayz has been mostly asking noob questions instead of making scumreads, which despite his "new"ness
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Post by cyan on Jun 21, 2020 1:49:51 GMT
Back, skimmed through the last 4 pages and nothing extremely big pops out to me. Discussion doesn't seem stunted, but here's a few things I'd like to address: ay somebody else who didn’t read what I said. cyan and GTS aren’t doing the same thing, GTS is telling people how to play and Cyan is just asking questions. my thoughts on tb2 wasn’t scummy, i just have no fucking clue what he’s saying, which isn’t scummy. what sky did also isn’t scummy, I just mentioned how he’s limiting his thoughts that I think are town to two ppl. same thing goes with vigvig, he’s said something that is townie and I mentioned how nobody has given their thoughts on it. AZ sr is because tracker =/= cop and it’s so much easier to find a tracker from a hypo than it is with a cop. I am not afraid to drop srs, I just don’t have too many at the moment and I need more people to speak. Ok well I think this shows how stupid your reasoning is. Its incredible that you think any of this is valid, please re evaluate all of your reasonings and tell me how they correlate to the alignment that you claim they are. This remark from Spiderz feels town, as hostile as it may be.
Question for micromorphic: Are you saying that because AZ is pushing for a sub-optimal move in hypoing tracker results, they are scum? What tells you that they aren't simply misguided town? And after reading on their more recent posts on using tracker as a functional Cop, what do you think of that?Aside from this one reply, things: - I'm jumping on the VigVig TR bandwagon. His posts do seem genuinely trying to help town to me. - dudeplayz's slot is... lazy? They're outright not willing to read up on the game, which isn't exactly what anyone would see as effective townplay. So I'm going to do what I did and just prod them (and cayden ig) for more information. In regards to GTS's lynch. My main issue with his slot is that he hasn't offered any in-depth discussion on anyone other than battler444, and his focus on that slot is quite slim. Sure, IIoA as a reason to lynch isn't exactly the most productive thing in the world, but the countervote is effectively the only read that he has pushed. I'm aware he's made a readpool, but until there's ample explanation for that the only thing I can gain from it stems from its existence. |
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Post by cyan on Jun 21, 2020 2:04:20 GMT
Concerning the hypo, Scorchie's plan of people hypo'ing "X targeted [dead person]" and "X did not target [dead person]" more or less fixes the problems, as it changes tracker to be more cop-esque role. It doesn't eliminate all the problems, but for the most part it seems good enough to be used! More regarding hypo strat: The problem with this is that only one of the Mafia will flip guilty to this pseudocop format of results at any given time. If Player X targeted a dead person, then a tracker claiming that they did basically gives us a 1/3 chance of said slot being scum if all town PRs are alive. It's information, to be sure, especially since we can't expect power roles to remain alive for the entirety of the game, but guilty results would be fairly unreliable, and would potentially result in unnecessary claims outing PRs. Moreover, the only conclusive Not Guilty result that we can expect is if a tracker receives information that Player Y targeted a still-living player, but outing this result would expose two Town PRs. I think that hypoing might be more trouble than it's worth. Scum will likely not be able to obtain NK data unless a townie misplays, but there's not much information to gather. Hypoing as a means of keeping the Tracker unseen is going to be as helpful as no one claiming results until, say, Lylo - 1. This is open for discussion. |
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Post by spiderz on Jun 21, 2020 2:07:35 GMT
SFL, Hostile =/= Scummy
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Post by spiderz on Jun 21, 2020 2:18:43 GMT
Heading to bed as I have not slept in 33+ hours, hoping a micro shift happens asap, and hopefully, I wake up with AZ still awake, please carry on discussion I wanna see 16 pages when I get back, keep it going folks.
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Post by cyan on Jun 21, 2020 2:42:08 GMT
ik. it's generally looked down upon, though |
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Post by skyfigueroa on Jun 21, 2020 5:55:59 GMT
OK im back and just realized my problem with blurb solved itself while I was writing my post and what he's said so far is fine by me. Honestly think I maxed out for the day so imma just nitpick some lines and put my thoughts out about them until people have anything else to discuss. Also I think it's safe to establish a Me/AZ/Scorr Town core for now. Lynches are between Tb2 and Micro today. Anyways following post will be dropping thoughts on Battler and Toni. For now, sure. I think most of if not everyone in the PL will agree that these 3 have been contributing a lot of good points and making pushes that are helping town which will make people think they are town. Spiderz is still my only TR out of the 3 though mostly because I feel like d1 anyone can make valid points for town to get that sweet towncred but I've stated a while ago that Spiderz kinda had that urgency and frustration trying to get reads is just town behavior to me. Not saying I SR az or scorr tho (They are definitely more townie than scummy rn and I think keeping them alive just helps town in general), it wouldn't be a surprise at all if they were both town, but out of the 3 I'd bet on locking in spiderz to be for sure the town. This is definitely the most logical and (kinda) obvious town core imo though and I think it's more of my pessimistic side not wanting to brush anyone over for either faction. Micro's half-assery isn't the towniest and tb2 logic appears if you spoke you're a tr unless you say something about me the you must be scum. Still feeling though when tb2 focuses on either me or spiderz it's been town v town. I'm gonna stick with battler444 lynch for now, at leas until I get a response. I already said i scumlean both players you've mentioned but I kinda wanna hear why you'd rather get a battler lynch over micro rn? Do you think gary is townie enough to be the lynch today because it would be nice if you could explain why. Also if gary isn't the lynch, who would you rather see getting lynched rn? @dudeplay25 |
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Post by skyfigueroa on Jun 21, 2020 5:57:11 GMT
^^ to not be the lynch today dudeplayz25 , I'm really half-asleep rn |
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Post by ScorrchingTheaph on Jun 21, 2020 7:44:29 GMT
Concerning the hypo, Scorchie's plan of people hypo'ing "X targeted [dead person]" and "X did not target [dead person]" more or less fixes the problems, as it changes tracker to be more cop-esque role. It doesn't eliminate all the problems, but for the most part it seems good enough to be used! More regarding hypo strat: The problem with this is that only one of the Mafia will flip guilty to this pseudocop format of results at any given time. If Player X targeted a dead person, then a tracker claiming that they did basically gives us a 1/3 chance of said slot being scum if all town PRs are alive. It's information, to be sure, especially since we can't expect power roles to remain alive for the entirety of the game, but guilty results would be fairly unreliable, and would potentially result in unnecessary claims outing PRs. Moreover, the only conclusive Not Guilty result that we can expect is if a tracker receives information that Player Y targeted a still-living player, but outing this result would expose two Town PRs. I think that hypoing might be more trouble than it's worth. Scum will likely not be able to obtain NK data unless a townie misplays, but there's not much information to gather. Hypoing as a means of keeping the Tracker unseen is going to be as helpful as no one claiming results until, say, Lylo - 1. This is open for discussion. I think I know how you arrived at 1/3, but it is wrong. There are 4 roles that target people at night: Tracker 1, Tracker B, Bodyguard, and one of Mafia Goons that is killing. Tracker 1 getting a result of a player targetting another dead player does not mean that their inspect is either Tracker B, Bodyguard, or Mafia Goons, which I think that is where you are getting 1/3. Bodyguard target will never be a dead player; due to the nature of their role they will die instead. Mafia Goon target will always be a dead player unless it is a Bodyguard death, which is not the case in this scenario. Let PL=# of players at nightstart. Tracker has a 1/(PL-1) chance of targetting a dead player. This means that if Tracker 1 inspects someone who targetted a dead person that did not flip as PR, there is an 1-1/(PL-1) chance they are Mafia, assuming random targets. im only 70% sure my math is correct so please double check me, but i know 1/3 is wrong Regardless, you are correct that a "guilty" inspect could be a false positive from a fellow Tracker. A high-risk high-reward strategy would be to leave the slot alive until either the real 2nd Tracker dies, or massclaim and/or lylo. That way, if they actually were Tracker they would still be able to get out inspects for as long as possible. The rest of PL would still have to hypo though, so in case the inspect was Mafia, the real 2nd Tracker would be able to get out inspects. |
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Post by ScorrchingTheaph on Jun 21, 2020 7:55:41 GMT
I understand why people sr gts, and I would hop on the wagon if it hadn't built up too much already. battler's reason for lynching gts is suspect. I also think literally any dude interaction makes 0 sense. dudeplayz has been mostly asking noob questions instead of making scumreads, which despite his "new"ness lynch ur sr coward |
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Post by spiderz on Jun 21, 2020 8:11:34 GMT
More regarding hypo strat: The problem with this is that only one of the Mafia will flip guilty to this pseudocop format of results at any given time. If Player X targeted a dead person, then a tracker claiming that they did basically gives us a 1/3 chance of said slot being scum if all town PRs are alive. It's information, to be sure, especially since we can't expect power roles to remain alive for the entirety of the game, but guilty results would be fairly unreliable, and would potentially result in unnecessary claims outing PRs. Moreover, the only conclusive Not Guilty result that we can expect is if a tracker receives information that Player Y targeted a still-living player, but outing this result would expose two Town PRs. I think that hypoing might be more trouble than it's worth. Scum will likely not be able to obtain NK data unless a townie misplays, but there's not much information to gather. Hypoing as a means of keeping the Tracker unseen is going to be as helpful as no one claiming results until, say, Lylo - 1. This is open for discussion. I think I know how you arrived at 1/3, but it is wrong. There are 4 roles that target people at night: Tracker 1, Tracker B, Bodyguard, and one of Mafia Goons that is killing. Tracker 1 getting a result of a player targetting another dead player does not mean that their inspect is either Tracker B, Bodyguard, or Mafia Goons, which I think that is where you are getting 1/3. Bodyguard target will never be a dead player; due to the nature of their role they will die instead. Mafia Goon target will always be a dead player unless it is a Bodyguard death, which is not the case in this scenario. Let PL=# of players at nightstart. Tracker has a 1/(PL-1) chance of targetting a dead player. This means that if Tracker 1 inspects someone who targetted a dead person that did not flip as PR, there is an 1-1/(PL-1) chance they are Mafia, assuming random targets. im only 70% sure my math is correct so please double check me, but i know 1/3 is wrong Regardless, you are correct that a "guilty" inspect could be a false positive from a fellow Tracker. A high-risk high-reward strategy would be to leave the slot alive until either the real 2nd Tracker dies, or massclaim and/or lylo. That way, if they actually were Tracker they would still be able to get out inspects for as long as possible. The rest of PL would still have to hypo though, so in case the inspect was Mafia, the real 2nd Tracker would be able to get out inspects. This is irrelevant but why the fuck do u say tracker 1 then tracker b (im gonna try and check that math later) |
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