|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 7, 2015 1:54:18 GMT
I cannot express how much I agree with Akno's last sentence. To be fair those same people usually are the best at scumhunting, but god, it just makes end-game awful to watch. By awful I assume you mean ridiculously hilarious because it's so sad. |
|
|
|
Post by incognito on Jan 7, 2015 10:06:18 GMT
Solution : Make 600 weird alts.
|
|
|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 7, 2015 16:57:42 GMT
Solution : Make 600 weird alts. You mean, like mine? |
|
|
|
Post by Floette on Jan 7, 2015 19:37:29 GMT
Solution : Make 600 weird alts. Then be called a nub who no one believes because you're new! |
|
Galom
Villager
Everybody's doing their time.
Posts: 63 
|
Post by Galom on Jan 8, 2015 14:35:16 GMT
Bringing up Hypo for discussion. It's a very important strategy to know how and when to do it, as if you are town when your teammates are enacting hypo and you are not participating, it really fucks it up. There have been a few instances recently where I've tried to get it going but most of the town just dropped the ball. First, let's look at what Hypo is, and when you're supposed to do it.
Hypo: a strategy enacted by town in games of Mafia in which everyone claims Cop and puts out an innocent investigation every day so that the Mafia do not know who the real Cop is. The point of Hypo is that it is the only way to protect your Cop from a Mafia PL. You NEVER do Hypo unless there is a MAFIA PL in the game. Everyone claims, so nobody knows who the real cop is. However, it is incredibly important that if you are not the real Cop, you never put out anything except "<player> is cleared" investigations. The Mafia PL will NOT know who to block, and it will practically guarantee one safe Mafia investigation.
It's honestly shocking how many people didn't even have a clue what this strategy was, or when you are supposed to do it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2015 14:50:57 GMT
Ironically, I learned about Hypo just yesterday on Epicmafia. I was the Mafia PL (the equivalent of it, at least). It made me sad.
Hypo can easily be disrupted by a Mafia with a fake guilty claim; However, should the cop be lynched in this case, they would still know all his real investigations. It helps keep the cop live for a day longer, and frustrates the mafia with trying to get around the people they 'cleared'.
|
|
|
|
Post by champetero on Jan 8, 2015 17:27:53 GMT
Follow the cop is a bit of a problem indeed, as it makes everyone lazy. But what if you are the cop and people follow you? That means you'll have to lead the town if you follow this system. Though I feel the cop is NOT a town leader in any way. As 9/10 there is a counter-claim of the cop it just doesn't work. In the case there's no mafia counter-claim the cop still has believable inspects, though that's ALL he has. Clearing some people or pointing at a confirmed mafia doesn't make you a town leader, while some do seem to think that. And because people think that they will follow the cop blindly, though sometimes the cop is a total idiot and the rest of the town is actually sort of smart about it, in that case it's not smart to follow the cop, and it doesn't happen very often in that case unless somehow the cop manages to seem smart. Personally I feel like this is one of the big reasons why some people don't really have a lot of skill with their games. There are of course other reasons (like not wanting to improve, I mean we had this amazing mentoring program for anything you want to learn, even though I am sure that I don't need the program I decided to see what I could learn from it, doesn't make me a noob.) but this is one that is the first we can do something about. As champ said we can do closed setups with no cops, but we could also do OPEN setups with no cops, or do special No setups with the rule of no cop, that would help with it too. I mean, everyone loves NS right? And Champ also said that 70% is shit at scumhunting, it's not just the scumhunting most people are bad at, it's also recognizing scummy moves, recognizing scummyness when someone is playing perfect as scum and not being scummy when being scum. AND NOT KILLING THE SAME PEOPLE NIGHT 1 EVERY TIME. I agree with this posts except the last sentence, Ganging up on someone night 1 is ps mafia tradition  from me to kraget to trans to eevee to aj to rssp1 to drookez etc. On a more serious note the main reason "follow the cop" is still huge in our userbase is because despite people wanting to remove it, those people usually just only say it and don't actually host or do anything that helps remove "follow the cop". |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2015 18:29:58 GMT
You should see the plan I've for my theme! Anybody who attempts to follow metagame trends without any thought will be thoroughly punished.
|
|
|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 8, 2015 19:29:13 GMT
You should see the plan I've for my theme! Anybody who attempts to follow metagame trends without any thought will be thoroughly punished. Lol >thoroughly Well I should be safe then. I never follow trends ;D |
|
|
|
Post by Floette on Jan 9, 2015 5:54:33 GMT
Ahem, today I used a new strategy for the mafia which gets rid of the cop. However, it only works when there are 3+ mafia, and is highly risky to do unless you have 4+ mafia in a game.
Step 1: Have one mafia claim cop, potentially cc'ing the town cop.
Step 2: The next day, sacrifice one of your mafia members to make you a "confirmed" cop.
Step 3: The real cop will get lynched the next day!
Step 4: The mafia who claims cop will get lynched.
But obviously this is best for a team of at least four mafia, as you'll have at least two mafia members remaining and thus you can win pretty easily soon after.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 9, 2015 13:44:46 GMT
Getting rid of 50% of your team in order to get rid of a cop and two other townies? I don't think any mafia would be wiling to go that path. And what do you mean by step two?
|
|
|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 9, 2015 17:25:11 GMT
Getting rid of 50% of your team in order to get rid of a cop and two other townies? I don't think any mafia would be wiling to go that path. And what do you mean by step two? He means that you got a scum inspect making you "clean." It might not work though, if town just lynched the cop and not the mafia claim. |
|
Galom
Villager
Everybody's doing their time.
Posts: 63
|
Post by Galom on Jan 9, 2015 17:52:19 GMT
This is what he means.
Day 1) Two people claim cop. Nobody gets lynched.
Night 1) One townie is killed.
Day 2) Fake cop sells out one of his allies to get lynched and to prove himself. Mafia gets lynched, fake cop gets "proven".
Night 2) One townie is killed.
Day 3) Town lynches the fake cop's CC. The real cop is lynched.
Night 3) One townie is killed.
Day 4) Fake cop gets lynched.
NET: 3 Townies + 1 Cop dead for 2 Mafia dead. Is it worth it? Not really. In many setups, this will leave 1 Mafia vs. (maybe, if he hasn't yet been lynched) one WW vs. like 5-6 town. Also, it's notable that the players will be able to go back and read the real cop's logs to see who was cleared. This means that, through process of elimination, the town could have up to a 50+% chance to lynch scum. With proper scumhunting and little stupidity, Town should be able to win it pretty easily. It's likely that the WW and Mafia will intersect eventually, only furthering the strategy's ineffectively.
TL;DR I disagree with "fake proving" by sacrificing a Mafia.
|
|
|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 9, 2015 19:12:22 GMT
This is what he means. Day 1) Two people claim cop. Nobody gets lynched. Night 1) One townie is killed. Day 2) Fake cop sells out one of his allies to get lynched and to prove himself. Mafia gets lynched, fake cop gets "proven". Night 2) One townie is killed. Day 3) Town lynches the fake cop's CC. The real cop is lynched. Night 3) One townie is killed. Day 4) Fake cop gets lynched. NET: 3 Townies + 1 Cop dead for 2 Mafia dead. Is it worth it? Not really. In many setups, this will leave 1 Mafia vs. (maybe, if he hasn't yet been lynched) one WW vs. like 5-6 town. Also, it's notable that the players will be able to go back and read the real cop's logs to see who was cleared. This means that, through process of elimination, the town could have up to a 50+% chance to lynch scum. With proper scumhunting and little stupidity, Town should be able to win it pretty easily. It's likely that the WW and Mafia will intersect eventually, only furthering the strategy's ineffectively. TL;DR I disagree with "fake proving" by sacrificing a Mafia. That's in standard classic set ups, partially because there's not much mafia. However, in larger games, especially with a lot of power roles and mafia, that strategy may prove invaluable. Example: Real Cop clears someone. Suddenly all the good power roles target that guy and bad power roles don't. Good as in benefits target and bad as in doesn't benefit target. Cop gets scum: Scum gets lynched, and even if the town doesn't beleive the cop enough to lynch, the good power roles will avoid, and some bad PRs will target. So really that strategy seems to work better the more Power Roles there are and the more scum there are. 1-1-5/6 is actually very good odds for scum, especially if the other scum dies quickly. However, it's pretty much equal odds for both scum, so the mafia gave up their numbers advantage over 3rd party. Also Galom, do consider that the scum parties can also go back and read who was cleared, but as kill targets instead. |
|
|
|
Post by Floette on Jan 9, 2015 21:14:09 GMT
This is what he means. Day 1) Two people claim cop. Nobody gets lynched. Night 1) One townie is killed. Day 2) Fake cop sells out one of his allies to get lynched and to prove himself. Mafia gets lynched, fake cop gets "proven". Night 2) One townie is killed. Day 3) Town lynches the fake cop's CC. The real cop is lynched. Night 3) One townie is killed. Day 4) Fake cop gets lynched. NET: 3 Townies + 1 Cop dead for 2 Mafia dead. Is it worth it? Not really. In many setups, this will leave 1 Mafia vs. (maybe, if he hasn't yet been lynched) one WW vs. like 5-6 town. Also, it's notable that the players will be able to go back and read the real cop's logs to see who was cleared. This means that, through process of elimination, the town could have up to a 50+% chance to lynch scum. With proper scumhunting and little stupidity, Town should be able to win it pretty easily. It's likely that the WW and Mafia will intersect eventually, only furthering the strategy's ineffectively. TL;DR I disagree with "fake proving" by sacrificing a Mafia. You don't have to agree with it. I explicitly stated that is very high risk to begin with. |
|
|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 9, 2015 21:46:09 GMT
This is what he means. Day 1) Two people claim cop. Nobody gets lynched. Night 1) One townie is killed. Day 2) Fake cop sells out one of his allies to get lynched and to prove himself. Mafia gets lynched, fake cop gets "proven". Night 2) One townie is killed. Day 3) Town lynches the fake cop's CC. The real cop is lynched. Night 3) One townie is killed. Day 4) Fake cop gets lynched. NET: 3 Townies + 1 Cop dead for 2 Mafia dead. Is it worth it? Not really. In many setups, this will leave 1 Mafia vs. (maybe, if he hasn't yet been lynched) one WW vs. like 5-6 town. Also, it's notable that the players will be able to go back and read the real cop's logs to see who was cleared. This means that, through process of elimination, the town could have up to a 50+% chance to lynch scum. With proper scumhunting and little stupidity, Town should be able to win it pretty easily. It's likely that the WW and Mafia will intersect eventually, only furthering the strategy's ineffectively. TL;DR I disagree with "fake proving" by sacrificing a Mafia. You don't have to agree with it. I explicitly stated that is very high risk to begin with. Technically, you said that it's high risk UNLESS ur in a game of 4+ mafia. Implying that it's not high-risk when u have four. I'm not arguing, just point ou t this hilarity. I personally think that that's not too viable in classic. But maybe a few more PR-heavy or just huger |
|
Galom
Villager
Everybody's doing their time.
Posts: 63
|
Post by Galom on Jan 12, 2015 18:53:31 GMT
I'd like to point out that you'd need a stupid amount of players for there to be 4 Mafia. I'm not even exactly sure, but it's more than 15. Even then, I feel like the strategy is more trouble then it's worth, since there will be so fucking many townies for the remaining Mafia to kill.
|
|
|
|
Post by incognito on Jan 12, 2015 19:07:51 GMT
I'd like to point out that you'd need a stupid amount of players for there to be 4 Mafia. I'm not even exactly sure, but it's more than 15. Even then, I feel like the strategy is more trouble then it's worth, since there will be so fucking many townies for the remaining Mafia to kill. 16 |
|
|
|
Post by champetero on Jan 12, 2015 19:14:28 GMT
for the record if you're going to claim cop and say your partner is mafia then i'd be like way better to do it in mylo.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2015 21:38:17 GMT
Then you might as well claim that a townie is scum
|
|
|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 12, 2015 22:19:03 GMT
Then you might as well claim that a townie is scum The point was to kill the cop lol. BTW I did that as a lyncher once, it worked perfectly.  |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2015 22:20:50 GMT
So, what merit can be given to this strategy that no other alternative can offer?
|
|
|
|
Post by Fort Colorcastle on Jan 12, 2015 22:28:01 GMT
So, what merit can be given to this strategy that no other alternative can offer? None. if you plan on killing the cop by sacrificing, might as well have one guy copclaim immediately and then nightkill the real cop cc. |
|
aknolan
Bodyguard
Aknolan the Unoriginal
Posts: 165
|
Post by aknolan on Jan 13, 2015 15:05:36 GMT
that's a good point fort, and after that you might be able to say "I was actually a towny trying to protect the cop." people might doubt it but if you would say that you wanted to unclaim it whenever the actual cop would find it so that he wouldn't have a real cc to worry about or something like that it would be a legit town strategy too
|
|
Galom
Villager
Everybody's doing their time.
Posts: 63
|
Post by Galom on Jan 13, 2015 16:31:03 GMT
So, what merit can be given to this strategy that no other alternative can offer? None. if you plan on killing the cop by sacrificing, might as well have one guy copclaim immediately and then nightkill the real cop cc. This. |
|
from me to kraget to trans to eevee to aj to rssp1 to drookez etc.